Re: A_priori Board is not being runned by the Guidelines
Posted by Foulplay on Sep 20, 2008; 5:24pm
URL: https://support.nabble.com/A-priori-Board-is-not-being-runned-by-the-Guidelines-tp1106461p1106610.html
Continued:
a_priori
662 posts Sep 17, 2008; 10:38pm Re: Weekly Poll Discussion: If you could remove ONE character from the show, who would it be? Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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In reply to this post by justafan434
justafan434 and tenchiwings
I've stated the facts on this several times on this thread and I'm not going to continue to repeat myself.
Anyone that doesn't like the way this forum is run, is free to leave.
The polls have been closed for now and everyone needs to cool off.
Any further comments in this thread that are not about which character you would like removed from the show will be deleted.
My words, He starts screaming and acting like a child, when he re-posted back to Tenchiwings and justafan434. Then he ran and closed the polls as if he had something to hide. Do you see the threats above? I didn't even get so much as a warning or an email.
Now, I'm going to take you to where he moves threads, when they become his Pet Peeve, Of course he only selectively remove the threads that he wants to. :
a_priori
662 posts Sep 16, 2008; 08:34pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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In reply to this post by a_priori
This thread has crossed my pet peeve threshold in regard to date sensitive topics and has also fallen out of the scope of ATWT episode discussion. I'm retitling the thread and moving it to the off-topic forum. Please keep the debate respectful.
My words,
No one was fighting or arguing in the thread, but Power Tripping A_priori felt the need to tell people to keep the debate, respectful.
Janet
288 posts Sep 16, 2008; 09:28pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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a_priori wrote:
This thread has crossed my pet peeve threshold in regard to date sensitive topics and has also fallen out of the scope of ATWT episode discussion. I'm retitling the thread and moving it to the off-topic forum. Please keep the debate respectful.
Ok, first, I really mean no disrespect here, I just have a question, not about all of your post because the respect thing I totally understand. But the date sensitive topic remark? Are you saying there is a time line that we can discuss a certain topic? I understand the wedding is over, And I think that I have been more than respectful in my debating with BA. I just think if there is a time line, we should know what that is. And I’m only asking because you said it was a pet peeve of yours.
a_priori
662 posts Sep 16, 2008; 10:52pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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Janet wrote:
Ok, first, I really mean no disrespect here, I just have a question, not about all of your post because the respect thing I totally understand. But the date sensitive topic remark? Are you saying there is a time line that we can discuss a certain topic? I understand the wedding is over, And I think that I have been more than respectful in my debating with BA. I just think if there is a time line, we should know what that is. And I’m only asking because you said it was a pet peeve of yours.
I'm sorry for not explaining myself Janet. I'm not saying that there is a time line for discussing a certain topics. But, I do have a thing about seeing older threads with the date in the title on he front page, it's just one of my pet peeves, because it can get confusing for forum users This particular thread really isn't that old, but I just recently did this with a couple of other similar dated threads that had been ongoing or gone off-topic so i'm doing the same here. I do understand that some threads inadvertently get off-topic and/or generate a lot of discussion and that's not a problem, but I will rename dated (in their title) threads and move them to off-topic if it looks like those threads have gone off-topic and will be around for a while to help avoid confusion on the front page. Hope that explains it.
Peter_Tchai
25 posts Sep 17, 2008; 02:53am Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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In reply to this post by a_priori
a_priori wrote:
This thread has crossed my pet peeve threshold in regard to date sensitive topics and has also fallen out of the scope of ATWT episode discussion. I'm retitling the thread and moving it to the off-topic forum. Please keep the debate respectful.
I can understand moving this thread to the off-topic forum, although I'm sure there are other threads that have gone off-topic that have not been moved there. I also think I need your definition of "respectful" or, rather, how you would define disrespectful, just to be clear.
a_priori
662 posts Sep 17, 2008; 06:34am Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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Peter_Tchai wrote:
I can understand moving this thread to the off-topic forum, although I'm sure there are other threads that have gone off-topic that have not been moved there. I also think I need your definition of "respectful" or, rather, how you would define disrespectful, just to be clear.
Peter, I have done this for the reasons stated a couple of comments above to Janet. BTW, this is not the first thread that has been renamed and moved. So, those participating on this thread shouldn't feel singled out. If the new name is a problem for anyone, let me know and I will change it.
"Keep the debate respectful" is just a reminder to everyone. Everyone here is an adult and should be able to gauge for themselves what an acceptable tone of discourse is with each other. The members of this forum have been doing a great job, in this regard, since the board opened in August and I'm quite thankful for that.
a_priori
662 posts Sep 17, 2008; 06:34am Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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Peter_Tchai wrote:
I can understand moving this thread to the off-topic forum, although I'm sure there are other threads that have gone off-topic that have not been moved there. I also think I need your definition of "respectful" or, rather, how you would define disrespectful, just to be clear.
Peter, I have done this for the reasons stated a couple of comments above to Janet. BTW, this is not the first thread that has been renamed and moved. So, those participating on this thread shouldn't feel singled out. If the new name is a problem for anyone, let me know and I will change it.
"Keep the debate respectful" is just a reminder to everyone. Everyone here is an adult and should be able to gauge for themselves what an acceptable tone of discourse is with each other. The members of this forum have been doing a great job, in this regard, since the board opened in August and I'm quite thankful for that.
Peter_Tchai
25 posts Sep 19, 2008; 04:14pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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In reply to this post by a_priori
a_priori wrote:
Peter_Tchai wrote:
I can understand moving this thread to the off-topic forum, although I'm sure there are other threads that have gone off-topic that have not been moved there. I also think I need your definition of "respectful" or, rather, how you would define disrespectful, just to be clear.
Peter, I have done this for the reasons stated a couple of comments above to Janet. BTW, this is not the first thread that has been renamed and moved. So, those participating on this thread shouldn't feel singled out. If the new name is a problem for anyone, let me know and I will change it.
"Keep the debate respectful" is just a reminder to everyone. Everyone here is an adult and should be able to gauge for themselves what an acceptable tone of discourse is with each other. The members of this forum have been doing a great job, in this regard, since the board opened in August and I'm quite thankful for that.
Thanks for the response, however I still find myself left with some questions.
First, in your post of Sep. 16, you initially declare that “This thread has crossed my pet peeve threshold in regard to date sensitive topics.” However, there are several “Episode Discussion” threads from August, still in the “General Discussions” forum so, apparently “datedeness” is not the primary criterion for moving a thread. Perhaps there are others that you have moved for this reason but, obviously not all of them.
You also comment that the thread “has also fallen out of the scope of ATWT episode discussion.” Here I must point out that one thread in particular (August 13) went quite quickly from direct discussions of the episode to an off-topic discussion, exclusively between Luvluke and LukeyInLove, of chest hair trimming and eye brow plucking, which then progressed to their individual dating practices and comments about shows other than ATWT. You do step in and comment to them about the off-topic nature of the discussion, but the thread was neither moved nor re-titled. Consistency would suggest that the “best man” thread should have received the same “warning” followed by allowing the discussion to end or return on topic, or the Aug. 13 thread should have been automatically re-titled and moved. The two threads, though fitting under the same criteria (datedness and off-topic discussion) were not treated the same.
This brings us to the re-titling of the thread. First, to re-title this thread as “Of best men and ice cream” trivializes what, to the greatest extent, was a relatively serious debate regarding the qualifications for being a best man, all directly related back to Holden being asked to be Aaron’s best man. If the Aug. 13 thread had been moved and re-titled “Of eyebrows and chest hair” there would have been some sense of consistency, but that is not what occurred. Obviously the whole “Ice cream” interjection reached a level of silliness that, as I’m sure you can observe by one of my responses to it, I found ridiculous and irritating. I must note, however, that the primary participants in the central debate were not the ones to bring in the “ice cream” distraction. Including that as part of the title for the thread is somewhat insulting to the central debate and those participating in it.
An inherent problem seems to arise with the practice of beginning a thread with a title that includes a date, then becoming bothered when an extended discussion keeps that thread high on the list within the forum in which it was created. It would only be logical if there were an automatic cut-off date (say, one week) when any “dated” thread is automatically moved to another forum, perhaps one titled, “Past episode discussions.” Once a “dated” thread seems to develop into a discussion of a particular topic, perhaps a note could be left in the forum in which it originated (the “General Discussions” forum) indicating a new (and appropriate, respectful) title, telling those interested in that thread how they can find it.
I find myself asking: is it not the primary purpose of a board such as this to engender discussions? It would seem that any practices that restrict discussions are counterproductive to the purposes of the board. You surely noticed that this thread had more than 1000 views; does that not indicate a high level of interest, for whatever reason? I would suggest that, rather than arbitrarily pushing a thread into automatic oblivion, by re-titling and moving it so that no one can ever find it again (just how would anyone who might have found this thread interesting be able to find it now?), it might be better to determine what made this particular thread interesting, and try to encourage the same level of discussion throughout the board.
As far as the “respectful/disrespectful” question, the problem is that, although we are all adults here, we come with a wide variety of opinions as to what does and does not fall under the category of “disrespectful.” If you have a particular operational definition in mind it would be best to spell that out rather than leaving participants on this board wondering whether or not their particular definition fits within the range of respectfulness that you are requiring. I’m sure you don’t want to point fingers directly at anyone (or perhaps you do?) but at least some examples, making them as hypothetical as you would like, would be helpful. It would be best to include this in either the “Forum guidelines and FAQ” or “How this board is moderated” – I may have missed it but, as far as I can see, the word “respectful” is not found anywhere in either of those. If you have some sort of rule you intend to impose related to respectfulness, that really should be stated up front.
As I close I will be very honest and say that my debate with Brhannadas is the first time I have found this board of much interest. Perhaps this is simply not the place for me if debates of this level are not to be allowed. I don’t find the “New Board” (i.e. “CBS forums”) particularly interesting either, and rarely go or post there. Admittedly, the “Old Board” got a little wild and woolly at times but it was, at all times, interesting.
a_priori
662 posts Sep 19, 2008; 07:49pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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Peter,
Just so you know, there is no need to parse my every word. I know you like debate, but I honestly don't have the time or desire to debate you or anyone on this issue. Moving the thread to off-topic and renaming the thread does not prevent you or anyone from engaging in debate or conversation on this thread or this forum. Participants and subscribers will still get email notifications and the thread is still on the main page of this board, and will remain so as long as the thread is active. In no way has this thread been sent to oblivion.
I previously explained my reasoning for renaming and moving threads like this and I'm not going to repeat myself. I don't have any motives beyond what I stated. Quite simply, this is not the first Episode Discussion thread that has been moved/renamed and it likely will not be the last. I will take your suggestions regarding the titling of the discussion threads into consideration, but as of now, I barely have enough time to make the updates that I do here on a daily basis, so anything that adds to the amount of time that I spend on this board will likely not occur at this moment. Although, it is likely that I will be adding a couple of moderators very soon. So, maybe at that point, some of your suggestions can come into play.
What I would suggest to you or anyone else that is concerned with the possibility that (dated) episode discussion threads could be renamed or moved at some point, is to start a separate thread on whatever specific topic you are interested in discussing in the appropriate sub-forum and make a reference to that thread in the episode discussion thread. This is much easier than worrying about it or taking it personal if at some point the topic owner or I decide to rename the thread and/or move it.
As far as the name of the thread goes... I didn't think it would be offensive, but I understand your point. I stated before that I would would rename it. Offer me a suggestion and I will do so.
No one has said that debates of this level are not allowed, so I'm not sure where you got that idea. My reminder to be respectful was, just that, a reminder. Trust me, if I see that anyone is getting out of control, I will send them a warning via email. Unless you hear from me about your conduct, you don't have anything to worry about. So please continue your debate. If you are expecting me to spell out exactly what you can do and can't do, that's not going to happen. I will try to clarify the forum guidelines a little more in this regard, but as I said we are all adults and I should not have to spell this out to everyone. The point of everyone being moderators of their own threads on this forum is to allow the members to decide how to carry themselves what is acceptable in their own threads. That doesn't mean that I will let threads on this forum run rampant just because I'm not the owner. But it does mean that I will expect the owner of the thread to be responsible about what happens in their thread and take action on their own if things goes out of control. In this particular case, I am the owner of this thread and I will be watching over it more than I probably would other threads that I don't own.
Whether you find any of this acceptable is up to you. I've tried to create the most welcoming environment that I could for ATWT fans that were displaced when CBS pulled their bullshit with the new board, but there is no way that I can make everyone happy.
That is all I have to say on this matter. I will try to clarify the forum guidelines over the weekend. Let me know what you think an acceptable name for the thread is and I will change it.
Peter_Tchai
25 posts Sep 19, 2008; 08:19pm Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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(This post was updated on Sep 19, 2008; 09:21pm)
a_priori wrote:
Peter,
Just so you know, there is no need to parse my every word. I know you like debate, but I honestly don't have the time or desire to debate you or anyone on this issue.
I don't recall asking for debate...just answers and response to some concerns. My main points were that this thread was treated differently than others which also fell under the criteria of datedness and off-topic. I can certainly understand the time constraints of keeping up with a board like this and I appreciate that you are at least willing to consider the thread titling / re-titling procedures and practices.
As far as whether or not the thread is in oblivion may be a matter of opinion...I'm sure you would view anything else I might say as debate, so I'm sure there's no use stating it. I would only suggest that you note how active the thread was before and how it essentially "died" once it had been re-titled and moved (without prior notice or warning, as was given the other thread I noted).
As far as any individual participant in a thread taking it upon themselves to move the discussion, there are several issues (and here I won't apologize for taking this to the level of debate as these are things I think should be considered). First, I doubt that many of us, as participants, have ever considered that might be necessary. Second, trying to decide if and when to do that requires a lot of second guessing as to whether such a move is really necessary. Third, I come to a board like this to discuss, not to plan the proper placement of the discussion; that falls to those who have designed and who "run" the board (yourself, in this case) which it would seem, out of courtesy to participants, to be done to make it as easy as possible to participate in the discussions. That is done far better here than on the "New Board" (i.e., CBS forums) which I find extremely user unfriendly. This board is considerably more user friendly and I have no criticisms for it in general -- I'm only raising questions regarding this single instance that involves me directly.
a_priori wrote:
I previously explained my reasoning for renaming and moving threads like this and I'm not going to repeat myself. I don't have any motives beyond what I stated. Quite simply, this is not the first Episode Discussion thread that has been moved/renamed and it likely will not be the last.
If my questions and comments prompted you to repeat yourself, then they would not have been expessed very well. I was not expecting you to repeat yourself but, rather, to provide clarification. I read your earlier responses so I know it's not the first or last Episode Discussion thread to be moved/renamed. The clarification I needed and/or perhaps the suggestion I was making was that any thread being moved should always be given the kind of "warning" given the Aug. 13 thread, so that if participants did decide to continue it, and moving it seemed to be the best route, they would have the opportunity to do so. Just asking for consistency.
a_priori wrote:
As far as the name of the thread goes... I didn't think it would be offensive, but I understand your point. I stated before that I would would rename it. Offer me a suggestion and I will do so.
Certainly, we can't always know when something we say or do might be offensive to someone and I'm sure you had no idea how those of us involved in the "best man" portion of the thread would react. As far as renaming this one, I think it's laid dormant long enough it's not really worth the effort now. This does go back to the point, though, that it would be good to "warn" or suggest to participants that a thread be moved and then either give them the opportunity to choose a title, or you (or another moderator) make a suggestion (which the participants have the chance to "critique"), all of this before the thread actually gets moved.
a_priori wrote:
My reminder to be respectful was, just that, a reminder. Trust me, if I see that anyone is getting out of control, I will send them a warning via email. Unless you hear from me about your conduct, you don't have anything to worry about. So please continue your debate. If you are expecting me to spell out exactly what you can do and can't do, that's not going to happen. I will try to clarify the forum guidelines a little more in this regard, but as I said we are all adults and I should not have to spell this out to everyone.
I don't recall asking you to "spell out exactly what you can and can't do" -- I believe I suggested providing examples and at least placing some wording related to being "respectful" in the forum guidelines. The fact that you will try to clarify the forum guidelines is all I was asking for. You can't enforce "rules" that no one even knows exist; and there are plenty of ways of expressing guidelines related to being respectful that don't make it necessary for you to "spell this out to everyone."
Don't feel any particular need to respond to this post; your response assures me that you have heard my concerns, which is all I was asking. The very fact that you are willing to consider clarifying the forum guidelines and also consider alternatives to naming and renaming "Episode Discussion" threads is a satisfactory response in itself. You're right that you certainly can't please everyone -- doing everything you can to keep it fair and open, and moderated without being restrictive is all that can be asked.
a_priori
662 posts Sep 20, 2008; 07:32am Re: Of Best Men & Ice Cream Reply Threaded More Reply to author
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Peter,
My coffee grinder seems to have stopped working this morning, so I'm in a bit of a debilitated state this morning without my caffeine. So, this may not make much sense, but...
You are right about me treating some threads differently. Dated Episode Discussion threads that go off topic and are very active will be treated differently. Unlike other episode discussion threads, they will continue pop up on the front page long after the episode has aired. This is the only reason that I treat some threads differently than others. I think it can be confusing/off putting to some forum visitors to see the front page of the forum filled with outdated topics and this is my effort to keep the board orderly/friendly/attractive to new members. While this might not be the best solution, this is what I felt was most achievable. I anticipated that this particular thread would be quite active for some time, thus the changes.
I think the fact that some of the previous participants, including yourself, have made comments in this thread since it was moved and renamed is proof that this thread is perfectly accessible to those than want to participate in it. All of the participants of this thread are quite intelligent and likely able to adapt to such a change. Perhaps the problem is that some felt I was trying to stifle the debate in moving/renaming the thread and were offended by my actions. If that is the case, I am sorry. That was not my intention and I hope that anyone that wants to continue discussion in this thread will feel free to do so. In the future, I will make a better effort to notify the participants of a thread if the need to move a thread or rename it arises.